JRE #2134 – Paul Stamets

This podcast delves into the world of mycology with Paul Stamets, a renowned mycologist, advocate for bioremediation, and champion of medicinal fungi. He shares his extensive knowledge and research on the potential of mushrooms to heal, shift consciousness, and even save the planet. The conversation touches on a wide range of topics, including controversial research on mushrooms and their impact on the human immune system, the importance of biodiversity, and the potential of microdosing for mental and physical well-being.

Here are 15 major topics covered in the podcast:

Agaricon: A Rare Mushroom with Potential

• The Agaricon’s history: Stamets details the long history of the Agaricon, a rare mushroom found in old-growth forests, dating back to Dioscorides, who called it the “elixir of long life.” It’s also revered by First Nations people in the Northwest.
• Agaricon’s antiviral properties: After 9/11, the Defense Department tested over two million samples, and the Agaricon emerged as one of the top ten most active against pox viruses, being the only natural product in the top ten.
• Agaricon’s potential for biodefense: Stamets argues that old-growth forests are cultural libraries essential for biodefense, as they hold a wealth of potentially valuable fungal strains. He has built the world’s largest Agaricon culture library.
• Agaricon and COVID-19 vaccine enhancement: Stamets reveals a double-blind placebo-controlled study showing Agaricon and Turkey Tail mushrooms, when taken alongside mRNA vaccines, can reduce vaccine side effects and enhance antibody response, potentially extending its duration.

Biodiversity, Bioremediation, and the Importance of Old-Growth Forests

• The declining state of old-growth forests: Stamets highlights the alarming decline of old-growth forests, with less than 1% remaining. These forests are vital for biodiversity and hold a vast array of fungal strains with potential medical applications.
• The threat of viral storms: Stamets argues that factory farming, urbanization, and the collision of ecosystems have created a perfect storm for emerging viral outbreaks, exemplified by the recent bird flu outbreak that has infected cattle.
• The need for international biodefense: Stamets emphasizes the importance of protecting old-growth forests as a matter of international defense, as viruses don’t recognize borders.
• The role of fungi in bioremediation: Stamets explains how fungi can be used to clean up contaminated environments, highlighting their ability to break down toxins and pollutants.

Medicinal Mushrooms and Their Impact on the Immune System

• The “entourage effect” of medicinal mushrooms: Stamets describes how the combined effects of different compounds within mushrooms create a synergistic effect, enhancing their overall impact on the immune system.
• The importance of the mycelium: He emphasizes that it’s not the mushroom’s fruiting body but the mycelium that has the most potent effects on the immune system, influencing its ability to upregulate immunity and downregulate inflammation.
• Mushrooms as prebiotics: Stamets explains how certain mushrooms, like Turkey Tail, can act as prebiotics, improving the microbiome and promoting gut health.
• Mushrooms and autoimmune disorders: Stamets touches on the potential of certain mushroom strains to address autoimmune disorders by modulating the immune response.

Psilocybin: A Controversial Substance with Potential

• Psilocybin’s potential for mental health: Stamets discusses ongoing research on the use of psilocybin for treating depression, anxiety, PTSD, and addiction. He believes it holds promise for a therapeutic revolution.
• Microdosing psilocybin: Stamets details his research on microdosing psilocybin, a practice where people take sub-perceptual doses of the substance, which he suggests can improve cognitive function, mood, and overall well-being.
• Psilocybin and neurogenesis: Stamets highlights the potential of psilocybin to stimulate neurogenesis, promoting the growth and development of new brain cells, which may have implications for brain health and cognition as we age.
• The push for psilocybin legalization: Stamets predicts that psilocybin will become legalized within the next five years, citing the growing public support for its therapeutic potential and the decriminalization efforts in several areas.

The History and Mythology of Mushrooms

• The “sacred” mushroom: Stamets discusses the history of mushrooms in various cultures, from their use by shamans in Siberia to their role in ancient Egyptian rituals.
• The “blue juice” of psilocybin mushrooms: Stamets reveals the ancient practice of extracting psilocybin from mushrooms to create a potent blue elixir, highlighting its presence in ancient Egyptian hieroglyphs and its use in various cultures across the globe.
• The “fly agaric” and its role in mythology: Stamets explores the mythology surrounding the fly agaric mushroom, known for its psychoactive properties, connecting it to Santa Claus, shamans, and the berserker warriors.
• The importance of ethnomycology: Stamets emphasizes the need to understand the historical and cultural use of mushrooms, arguing that traditional knowledge can inform modern research and understanding of their potential benefits.

Other Topics

• The “starship fungi perfecti”: Stamets talks about his company, Fungi Perfecti, which produces a wide range of mushroom-based products, including medicinal supplements and bioremediation products. He highlights the challenges of building a company dedicated to mushroom research and the importance of financial investment in the field.
• The role of observational studies: Stamets argues that observational studies, which collect data from large populations, can provide valuable insights and signals that can guide future research and clinical trials. He highlights his research on microdosing psilocybin, which utilizes a large observational study through the “microdose.me” app.
• The potential of artificial intelligence: Stamets explores the potential of artificial intelligence to revolutionize medicine and scientific research. He is optimistic about AI’s ability to analyze vast datasets and identify new patterns and insights. However, he also cautions that AI lacks the capacity to understand human emotion, intentionality, and the power of human connection.
• The fentanyl crisis: Stamets discusses the devastating impact of the fentanyl crisis, emphasizing the need for a public health approach that prioritizes harm reduction and treatment. He suggests that decriminalization and legalization of psilocybin could play a role in addressing the crisis.
• The “last hope” of psychedelics: Stamets ends the podcast by highlighting his belief that psychedelics, particularly psilocybin, offer a potential “last hope” for humanity to confront the existential challenges we face. He emphasizes the importance of personal experience and the need for open dialogue about these substances.

5 Memorable Quotes

• “Don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good.” – Stamets stresses that while understanding the mechanisms behind the benefits of Agaricon and Turkey Tail is crucial, it shouldn’t overshadow the fact that they work.
• “I can’t believe I got the Nobel Prize because I know shit about the immune system.” – Stamets quotes a Nobel laureate in immunology, highlighting the immense complexity of the immune system.
• “The mushrooms are chemical wizards.” – Stamets emphasizes the incredible potential of mushrooms to produce unique molecules that can benefit human health.
• “The fact that you can take a natural product that’s been used for thousands of years… and now in this time we are finding we have a hundred plus strains of Agaricon… I think we have a super strain in my library.” – Stamets expresses his excitement about discovering potent Agaricon strains with potential medical applications.
• “I think we are at the convergence of possibly multiple virus and viral pandemics converging at the same time. That is not improbable at all.” – Stamets emphasizes the urgent need to strengthen our immune systems and be prepared for future viral outbreaks.