JRE #2039 - Michael Easter

26-Sep-23

Major Topics in Joe Rogan Experience #2039 – Michael Easter

This podcast features a conversation with Michael Easter, a health and fitness writer and author of “Scarcity Brain,” exploring the topic of the human craving mindset and how it influences our pursuit of happiness and fulfillment. The conversation delves into how our evolutionary past and present technology are shaping our desire for status, information, possessions, and ultimately, our relentless search for enough. Easter weaves compelling stories and scientific insights to unveil the hidden mechanics behind our behaviors, leaving the audience with a deeper understanding of human nature and its potential for both progress and self-destruction.

Provocative topics include the potential pitfalls of our insatiable appetite for information, the seductive power of the scarcity loop, the complexities of addiction, and the paradoxical role of technology in shaping human behavior. Underlying themes examine the disconnect between our ancient biology and the rapidly evolving modern world, the importance of finding meaning and purpose in a world of abundance, and the critical need to embrace uncertainty and self-awareness in our quest for a fulfilling life.

1. Ancient Origins of Scarcity and Modern Abundance:

Humans evolved in a world of scarcity, where the pursuit of resources like food, shelter, and information was crucial for survival. This drive is deeply ingrained in our biology, leading to an insatiable craving for more.
The modern world has transitioned into an era of unprecedented abundance, but our brains haven’t adapted to this shift. We remain programmed to crave more, even when our basic needs are met, leading to a state of perpetual dissatisfaction.
Examples: The average American home now holds 10,000 items, far exceeding the needs of our ancestors, yet we remain driven to accumulate more. Similarly, access to information has exploded with the internet, but this abundance can overwhelm and confuse, leading to a sense of being less informed.
Easter argues that our evolved need for scarcity is at odds with the realities of modern abundance, resulting in behaviors like compulsive shopping, excessive information consumption, and the endless pursuit of fleeting pleasures.

2. The Scarcity Loop:

Easter describes the “scarcity loop” as a three-part behavioral cycle that exploits our inherent craving for more, leading to addiction and a relentless pursuit of unfulfilling rewards.
The three parts are opportunity, unpredictable rewards, and quick repeatability. This loop is particularly evident in activities like gambling, social media, and gig work, where the promise of potential reward and the ease of repetition keep us hooked.
Examples: Slot machines offer the opportunity to win money, but the rewards are unpredictable, and the ease of pressing the button keeps players engaged. Social media platforms offer the opportunity for status and likes, but the unpredictable response and the constant notification pings keep us checking back for more.
Easter contends that our evolutionary past, where finding food required constant searching with unpredictable results, has laid the foundation for our susceptibility to the scarcity loop, which is now exploited by various industries, including gambling, technology, and even the gig economy.

3. The Paradox of Technology:

While technology has brought about immense progress, it has also created new challenges for our mental and emotional well-being. The ease of access to information, entertainment, and communication can lead to overconsumption and a sense of being overwhelmed.
Easter highlights the increasing difficulty of discerning truth from fiction in a world flooded with information. The internet has democratized knowledge, but it has also created a breeding ground for misinformation and manipulation.
Examples: The ease of finding information online can make it easier to confirm existing biases and reinforce misinformation. The constant bombardment of notifications and the allure of instant gratification can lead to a diminished attention span and a decreased capacity for deeper thinking.
Easter argues that technology’s rapid advancement has outpaced our ability to adapt, creating a clash between our ancient biology and the demands of the modern world, potentially leading to an inevitable integration between humans and technology.

4. The Quest for Meaning and Purpose:

Easter emphasizes the need for finding meaning and purpose beyond the pursuit of material possessions, status, and fleeting pleasures. He argues that true fulfillment lies in pursuing a higher purpose and contributing to something larger than oneself.
He explores the lives of Benedictine monks, who live a life of austerity and dedication to their faith, finding contentment and happiness despite their challenging lifestyle. He suggests that their focus on purpose and community contributes to their elevated sense of well-being.
Examples: Finding meaning through creative pursuits, volunteering, or engaging in meaningful relationships can provide a sense of purpose that is more enduring than the pursuit of material wealth or status.
Easter contends that true happiness and fulfillment are not found in endless accumulation, but in aligning our actions with a higher purpose that resonates with our values and aspirations.

5. The Illusion of Quantification:

Easter raises concerns about the increasing reliance on quantification and metrics, arguing that we often sacrifice deeper understanding and meaning in favor of readily measurable data points.
He discusses how metrics like GPAs in education, likes and retweets on social media, and even antler scores in hunting can distort our values and behavior, leading us to prioritize the numbers over the original purpose.
Examples: A student might prioritize achieving a high GPA over developing a deep understanding of a subject. A social media user might focus on gaining likes and retweets rather than engaging in meaningful conversations. A hunter might prioritize a large antler score over the ethical and ecological considerations of hunting.
Easter argues that we need to be mindful of the limitations of quantification and the potential for metrics to shift our focus from meaningful goals to the arbitrary pursuit of numbers.

6. Addiction as a Symptom of Underlying Problems:

Easter challenges the common perception of addiction as a brain disease, suggesting it is more accurately understood as a symptom of deeper underlying problems. He argues that addictive substances often provide temporary solutions to unresolved issues, creating a cycle of dependence and long-term harm.
He explores the rise of Kaptagon, a stimulant drug sweeping across the Middle East, highlighting the context of war, trauma, and economic hardship as contributing factors to its widespread use. He observes that addiction flourishes in environments where individuals are seeking solace and escape from pain.
Examples: Someone who struggles with anxiety might turn to alcohol to self-medicate, providing temporary relief but ultimately exacerbating the problem. Someone who experiences loneliness and isolation might find solace in drugs or gambling, but these behaviors will ultimately deepen their sense of isolation.
Easter contends that addressing the root causes of addiction, such as unresolved trauma, unmet needs, and a lack of purpose, is crucial for breaking free from the cycle of dependence.

7. The Importance of Self-Awareness:

Easter emphasizes the importance of self-awareness in navigating the challenges of modern life, recognizing our triggers, and making conscious choices that align with our values.
He advocates for embracing uncertainty and acknowledging the limitations of our knowledge, rather than seeking false certainty in numbers and external validation. He encourages exploring different perspectives and challenging our own biases to cultivate a more nuanced understanding of ourselves and the world around us.
Examples: Recognizing the triggers that lead us to overeat, overspend, or become excessively consumed by social media can help us make conscious choices to moderate those behaviors. Engaging in open dialogue with people who hold different views can help us challenge our own assumptions and gain a deeper understanding of complex issues.
Easter argues that cultivating self-awareness and a willingness to question our assumptions are essential tools for navigating a world of constant change and uncertainty.

8. The Power of Purposeful Action:

Easter highlights the transformative power of aligning our actions with a higher purpose, finding fulfillment in pursuing goals that resonate with our values and aspirations.
He emphasizes the importance of taking action, embracing challenges, and pursuing goals that are meaningful to us, even in the face of setbacks and adversity. He suggests that persistence against negative consequences, when applied to constructive pursuits, can lead to extraordinary growth and achievement.
Examples: Pursuing a career that aligns with our passions, engaging in activities that challenge and inspire us, and contributing to causes we believe in can provide a sense of purpose and fulfillment that transcends the pursuit of material wealth or fleeting pleasures.
Easter contends that aligning our actions with a higher purpose can not only bring about personal growth but also create a ripple effect of positivity in the world.

9. The Role of Community and Connection:

Easter emphasizes the importance of connection and belonging, arguing that fostering strong relationships and supporting others can contribute to our overall well-being. He highlights the role of community in providing a sense of purpose and meaning, and how isolation can exacerbate the pursuit of fleeting rewards.
He shares his experience living with Benedictine monks, who prioritize community and a shared purpose, despite their austere lifestyle. He emphasizes the benefits of engaging in meaningful interactions with others, both in person and online, while avoiding harmful behaviors like online negativity.
Examples: Joining a local club, volunteering for a cause we care about, or simply making an effort to connect with friends and family can all contribute to a sense of belonging and purpose.
Easter contends that forging meaningful connections with others can provide a powerful antidote to the isolation and loneliness that can fuel addictive behaviors and an endless pursuit of more.

10. The Importance of Physical Activity and Diet:

Easter emphasizes the importance of physical activity and a balanced diet, particularly in a world where processed foods and sedentary lifestyles are prevalent. He argues that regular exercise and a whole-food diet can not only improve our physical health but also contribute to our mental and emotional well-being.
He highlights the example of the Tsimane tribe, who live a subsistence lifestyle in the Bolivian Amazon, and have exceptionally healthy hearts. Their diet, while not restrictive, is largely based on minimally processed whole foods, highlighting the benefits of a balanced and natural approach to eating.
Examples: Engaging in activities that challenge and stimulate us physically, such as hiking, running, or team sports, can provide a sense of accomplishment and well-being.
Easter contends that embracing a holistic approach to health, incorporating regular physical activity and a diet rich in whole foods, can contribute to a more fulfilling and sustainable lifestyle.

11. The Role of Nature and Wilderness:

Easter emphasizes the importance of connecting with nature, particularly through activities like hunting, hiking, and camping, as a means of finding balance, purpose, and a deeper understanding of ourselves.
He recounts his own experiences hunting elk in the Utah wilderness, highlighting the physical and mental challenges of the pursuit, and the sense of satisfaction and fulfillment that comes from successfully navigating a challenging environment.
Examples: Spending time in nature, whether hiking, camping, or simply enjoying a walk in the park, can provide a sense of peace and tranquility, reducing stress and improving mood.
Easter argues that experiencing the wild, facing challenges, and connecting with the natural world can provide a sense of perspective and meaning that is often missing in our modern, over-stimulated lives.

12. The Ethics of Hunting:

Easter acknowledges the ethical considerations surrounding hunting, advocating for a sustainable and ethical approach. He argues that hunting, when done responsibly, can play a role in managing wildlife populations, ensuring the health of ecosystems, and providing a source of healthy food.
He points out the environmental impact of modern agriculture and the often overlooked loss of life associated with food production, suggesting that hunting, when done ethically, can be a more sustainable and humane approach to obtaining meat.
Examples: Respecting the animal, harvesting only what is needed, and understanding the role of hunting in maintaining a healthy ecosystem are all essential ethical considerations.
Easter contends that a well-informed and ethical approach to hunting can provide a connection to nature, a source of sustenance, and a way to contribute to the well-being of ecosystems.

13. The Challenges of Politics and Leadership:

Easter examines the challenges of political leadership, particularly in navigating complex issues like homelessness, addiction, and public health crises.
He acknowledges the difficulty of making decisions in the face of uncertainty and the pressure to conform to public opinion, highlighting the need for politicians to prioritize the well-being of their constituents while acknowledging the limitations of their knowledge.
Examples: The COVID-19 pandemic forced leaders to make difficult decisions with limited information, highlighting the importance of transparency, open communication, and a willingness to adjust policies based on new evidence.
Easter suggests that a more compassionate and informed approach to politics, one that acknowledges the complexities of human behavior and the importance of finding solutions that address root causes, can lead to more effective and humane outcomes.

14. The Unpredictability of Life and the Importance of Adaptability:

Easter emphasizes the inherent unpredictability of life and the importance of being adaptable and resilient in the face of setbacks and challenges. He highlights the need to find ways to cope with the inevitable ups and downs of life, recognizing that our efforts to control our environment often lead to frustration and dissatisfaction.
He recounts the story of Kurt Angle, an Olympic gold medalist who faced a series of physical setbacks and ultimately succumbed to addiction, underscoring the vulnerability of even the most accomplished individuals to life’s unpredictable turns.
Examples: Developing resilience and a willingness to embrace change can help us navigate the challenges and uncertainties of life. Cultivating a sense of gratitude and appreciating the present moment can help us find contentment amidst the inevitable storms.
Easter argues that embracing the unpredictability of life, developing the tools to adapt to change, and finding meaning in our experiences, can lead to a more fulfilling and enriching journey.

15. The Importance of Finding Your Path:

Easter emphasizes the importance of finding your own path to fulfillment, recognizing that what works for one person may not work for another. He encourages listeners to explore different approaches, experiment, and learn from their experiences.
He encourages listeners to find activities and communities that resonate with their individual needs and aspirations, embracing the challenges and uncertainties of the journey, and recognizing that the process of growth and discovery is often the most rewarding part of the experience.
Examples: Exploring different hobbies, engaging in activities that challenge us physically and mentally, and connecting with people who share our interests can all contribute to a sense of fulfillment.
Easter concludes by urging listeners to embark on their own unique journeys of exploration and discovery, embracing the complexities of human experience and the potential for both growth and fulfillment.

5 Memorable Quotes:

“If you think about how people explore today, we still explore in a sense, but it’s mediated through the internet. It’s like we have this urge to find information that can enhance our life. In the past, you had to go there. You had to go talk to someone. You had to go up around the river bend. You had to go, ‘Okay. Where is this greener grass? I’m gonna go find it on foot.’ And it’s gonna be there’s gonna be some amount of effort. Now when we have this sort of information itch, we scratch it through a screen, which on one hand, that’s great because we can get information quickly. On the other hand, it’s so easy to access and there’s so little effort we have to do, I think sometimes we get overwhelmed by it, and it’s a very different form of information we can get today.”

“It’s like they’re in the casinos, obviously, but they’re in the gas stations, the grocery stores, the restaurants, the bars, and the airport. And they’re not sitting empty. People were playing them around the clock. So I’m like, what the hell is up with that? It just plays in your dopamine. Well, and it doesn’t make sense because everyone knows the house always wins. It’s not it’s like a numbing thing. They just sit there and press the buttons and press the buttons and press the buttons and hope they make money.”

“That’s the thing about uncertainty, and this is the thing that you have when you’re in college, or this is the thing you have when you’re embarking upon a risky career. Like, there’s so much uncertainty. Is this gonna work for me? Am I gonna make it? Is it gonna happen? Or I’m gonna or am I gonna be left out like every am I am I gonna be one of the people that doesn’t make not gonna be one of those sad stories? Like this person, they just failed in life, and they wanna die in a heroin overdose. You know, like, no one wants to be that guy.”

“I think a lot of times what makes people happy is not necessarily chasing the next item, that sort of chase of, ‘I’m gonna buy this thing. I’m gonna hit this amount of money. I’m gonna do this.’ It is finding some sort of higher purpose, trying to do the next right thing, however you interpret that, and eventually, people wind up finding themselves happy.”

“If you can get over this, you can apply your your crazy brain, there’s behaviors to something that will enhance your life, and that makes you pretty damn unstoppable.”

JRE #2039 – Michael Easter