JRE MMA Show #90 with Rashad Evans

This episode of the Joe Rogan Experience dives deep into the world of mixed martial arts, featuring former UFC Light Heavyweight Champion Rashad Evans. Rogan and Evans discuss a wide range of topics, from the psychological impact of fighting to the evolution of MMA training methods. Provocative conversations about psychedelics, veganism, and the mental toughness required to be an elite fighter are sure to spark interest, while underlying themes explore the importance of self-awareness, the search for meaning, and the challenges of transitioning from a competitive career.

1. Rashad Evans’ Journey to Veganism:

• Evans’ vegan journey started after a profound psychedelic experience, specifically a mushroom ceremony and a subsequent 5-MeO-DMT trip.
• These experiences prompted a shift in his consciousness, leading to a complete overhaul of his diet, mindset, and spirituality.
• Evans’ experience highlights the potential for psychedelics to catalyze personal growth and transformation, leading to significant life changes.
• He believes that a vegan diet, paired with his new spiritual outlook, has revolutionized his life, improving his mental, physical, and spiritual well-being.

2. The Impact of Injuries on a Fighter’s Mindset:

• Evans recounts his multiple ACL surgeries, emphasizing how these injuries not only impacted his physical abilities but also his mental state as a fighter.
• He describes the mental toll of losing the explosiveness in his legs and the resulting frustration of not being able to regain his former power.
• This conversation highlights the importance of mental resilience for athletes and the challenges of overcoming significant physical setbacks.
• Evans’ story serves as a testament to the mental struggles that accompany serious injuries, especially in a sport as demanding as MMA.

3. The Importance of Mental Toughness in MMA:

• Rogan and Evans discuss the fine line between having a burning desire to be the best and letting mistakes and setbacks consume you.
• They agree that while a certain level of intensity is needed for elite performance, becoming too attached to the outcome can hinder progress.
• The discussion delves into the concept of “blissful ignorance,” arguing that a carefree mindset, unburdened by doubt, can be a significant asset in combat sports.
• This conversation explores the psychological nuances of high-level competition and the importance of finding a balance between relentless pursuit and mindful execution.

4. The Evolution of MMA Training Methods:

• Evans highlights the significant changes in training methodology, shifting from high-intensity, almost reckless practices to a more professional and strategic approach.
• He speaks about the rise of super camps like American Top Team and Blackzilians, emphasizing the importance of comprehensive training programs that encompass everything from nutrition to strength and conditioning.
• Evans credits the emergence of performance institutes for promoting a higher level of professionalism and knowledge within the sport.
• This conversation showcases how the sport has evolved, incorporating advanced training techniques and emphasizing the importance of holistic development for fighters.

5. The Potential of Psychedelics in Sports and Mental Health:

• Evans advocates for the therapeutic potential of psychedelics, specifically psilocybin, for athletes struggling with mental health challenges.
• He shares his involvement with the Denver psilocybin initiative and a real-world study in partnership with John Hopkins University, focusing on the healing benefits of the substance.
• Evans believes that psychedelics can help fighters find clarity, confront inner demons, and develop a new perspective on their careers, potentially aiding in their mental recovery.
• This conversation opens a dialogue about the potential therapeutic applications of psychedelics, challenging the stigma surrounding these substances and exploring their potential benefits for individuals and society.

6. The “Stone Ape Theory” and the Impact of Psychedelics on Human Evolution:

• Evans delves into the controversial “Stone Ape Theory,” which proposes that psilocybin played a pivotal role in human brain evolution.
• The theory argues that early hominids’ consumption of psilocybin, found in cow dung, contributed to the significant brain size increase observed in the fossil record.
• This intriguing theory raises questions about the role of psychedelics in our evolutionary history and the potential for these substances to shape our cognitive abilities.
• The discussion explores the fascinating intersection of anthropology, biology, and psychedelics, prompting further inquiry into the potential connection between these fields.

7. The Importance of Finding Meaning Beyond Competition:

• Evans candidly discusses the challenges of transitioning from a career defined by competition to a life beyond the fight.
• He shares his personal journey of finding purpose in a new way, shifting from a focus on personal glory to a desire to help others achieve their goals.
• The conversation highlights the importance of finding meaning outside of a competitive environment and embracing the next chapter in life.
• Evans’ story is a reminder that a fulfilling life can be found beyond the pursuit of victory, with an emphasis on helping others and contributing to the world in a meaningful way.

8. The Unique Training Style of Mark Henry:

• Evans describes the unconventional training methods of Mark Henry, who incorporates a unique code system based on personal values and family relationships into his coaching.
• Henry uses code words to represent different techniques, allowing him to guide his fighters during sparring sessions, almost like a game.
• Evans’ description highlights the importance of personalized training methods and the power of a coach who can not only develop skills but also tap into the individual’s motivations.
• This conversation emphasizes the importance of a coach who can connect with a fighter on a deeper level, understanding their values and using that understanding to enhance their performance.

9. The Importance of Mental Preparation and Visualization:

• Evans shares his own visualization techniques, highlighting the importance of mentally preparing for every scenario and working through adversity in his mind.
• He discusses the power of focusing on the execution of techniques, rather than dwelling on potential outcomes, and the importance of creating a mental blueprint for success.
• Evans emphasizes the role of visualization in combat sports, allowing fighters to practice scenarios, develop mental resilience, and boost their confidence.
• This conversation reveals the significant role of mental preparation in MMA, demonstrating how visualizing success can be as crucial as physical training.

10. The Cultural Impact of Eastern European Fighters:

• Evans reflects on the unique training culture of Eastern European fighters, known for their intensity, discipline, and hard work.
• He describes their tendency to incorporate acrobatic moves and a more dynamic approach to sparring, emphasizing their creative and unconventional styles.
• The discussion showcases the diverse range of fighting styles within MMA and the influence of cultural backgrounds on training methodologies.
• This conversation provides insight into the cultural influences that shape fighting styles and the importance of embracing diversity within the sport.

11. The Rise of Calf Kicks in MMA:

• Rogan and Evans discuss the increasing prevalence of calf kicks in MMA, recognizing their effectiveness in slowing down opponents and potentially causing significant damage.
• They analyze the effectiveness of various calf kick techniques, including the oblique kick and the lower calf kick, emphasizing the importance of proper technique and conditioning.
• The conversation highlights the evolution of striking techniques in MMA, with a focus on the use of leg kicks to target specific vulnerabilities in opponents’ bodies.
• This discussion provides a tactical breakdown of calf kicks in MMA, showcasing their effectiveness as a weapon and the strategic considerations involved in employing them.

12. The Importance of Proper MMA Equipment:

• Evans discusses the need for specialized MMA equipment that caters to the unique demands of the sport, highlighting the shortcomings of borrowed boxing or kickboxing gear.
• He praises the work of Trevor Whitman, who has developed a line of MMA gloves, knee braces, and headgear designed specifically for the sport, offering enhanced protection and functionality.
• Evans believes that investing in proper equipment can help mitigate injuries, particularly during training, ultimately allowing fighters to train more effectively and extend their careers.
• This conversation underscores the importance of equipment innovation in MMA, recognizing the need for gear that specifically addresses the sport’s unique demands and minimizes injury risks.

13. The Importance of Finding Balance in Life:

• Evans emphasizes the importance of finding a balance between the intense drive to succeed and the need for self-care and relaxation.
• He advocates for the benefits of yoga, particularly hot yoga, both for physical flexibility and mental clarity, emphasizing its role in cleansing the mind and promoting a sense of peace.
• Evans’ personal experience highlights how incorporating self-care practices, like yoga and meditation, can help individuals find balance, manage stress, and improve their overall well-being.
• This conversation encourages listeners to prioritize self-care and explore different practices that promote mental and physical health, recognizing the importance of balance in achieving a fulfilling life.

14. The Dangers of Guru Worship and Blind Faith:

• Evans shares his thoughts on the dangers of blindly following a guru, highlighting the controversy surrounding Bikram Choudhury and the allegations of sexual misconduct associated with his practice of hot yoga.
• He encourages listeners to be cautious of individuals who exert excessive influence and to recognize the importance of critical thinking and questioning authority, especially in spiritual or philosophical contexts.
• Evans’ experience with Bikram yoga, juxtaposed with the allegations against Choudhury, serves as a cautionary tale about the dangers of blind faith and the need for discernment in choosing mentors and teachers.
• This conversation reminds listeners that even seemingly positive practices can be tainted by unethical individuals, emphasizing the importance of exercising caution and critical thinking in all areas of life.

15. The Importance of Understanding and Embracing Diversity:

• Evans recognizes the importance of embracing diversity within the sport of MMA, acknowledging the unique training styles and cultural influences that shape fighters’ approach to the sport.
• He values the knowledge and experience gained from training with fighters from various backgrounds, including Eastern European fighters and those with a strong background in traditional martial arts.
• This conversation highlights the importance of open-mindedness and the potential for learning and growth through interacting with individuals from different cultures and perspectives.
• Evans’ journey as a fighter emphasizes the richness and depth that diversity brings to MMA, encouraging listeners to embrace the unique perspectives and experiences that contribute to the sport’s vibrant tapestry.

Memorable Quotes:

• “It’s been one of the things I can honestly say that’s just revolutionized my complete everything. It’s been everything that lately that has, you know, changed me from a mental standpoint, physical standpoint, and even a spiritual standpoint.” – Rashad Evans on the impact of veganism.
• “When I did the mushrooms, the mushrooms were kind of like the rivers and the lakes that leads to the ocean and it helps me understand how I am part of something so big and something so grand.” – Rashad Evans on the transformative nature of psychedelics.
• “It is sometimes it’s that fucking fire, that anger, that fear, that drive inside of you to be elite, to be the best, and sometimes that comes with every practice you have to win everything you have to do.” – Joe Rogan on the mental intensity required to be an elite fighter.
• “I think that we’ve we’ve turned the corner in that meaning in fact that there’s there’s so much out there, so much knowledge out there in the sport and everything else like that if you’re gonna be judging it, you got at least know when somebody is is winning around.” – Joe Rogan on the increasing level of expertise within MMA.
• “That’s why I’m so excited to work with unlimited sciences, you know, and doing something I’m passionate about because I’m passionate about psychedelics and I’m passionate, you know, that’s what I really like that and I think that that can help people.” – Rashad Evans on his desire to use his experience to help others.