JRE #1076 – Phil Demers

2/9/2018

This podcast features Phil Demers, a former professional marine mammal trainer at Marineland in Canada. He is known as the “walrus whisper” and discusses the contentious history of Marineland, his own experiences as a trainer, and the ongoing legal battles he faces after speaking out against the facility. The podcast delves into the ethical treatment of marine mammals in captivity, the complex nature of animal intelligence, and the inherent challenges of advocating for animals who cannot speak for themselves. Underlying themes explore the intricate relationship between humans and animals, the power dynamics in the animal entertainment industry, and the importance of challenging the status quo when it comes to animal welfare.

Major Topics:

Phil Demers’ Imprint on Smootie the Walrus

1. Phil Demers’ imprint on Smootie the walrus happened during a traumatic blood-drawing procedure, where Smootie, a young walrus, became agitated and imprinted on Phil as her mother.
2. This rare and unusual bond developed at an advanced age for imprinting, demonstrating the depth of Smootie’s connection to Phil.
3. Smootie’s bond with Phil makes her unreliable for performances, as she constantly seeks him out, leading Marineland to keep her hidden from public display.
4. Phil’s relationship with Smootie is a central point of contention in the legal battle between him and Marineland, as they accuse him of plotting to steal her.

Marineland’s History of Animal Cruelty and Legal Disputes

1. Phil Demers quit Marineland after witnessing a breakdown in water disinfection units, leading to high chlorine levels and harmful effects on the animals.
2. He alleges numerous instances of animal cruelty, including skin peeling, ulcers, bleeding, and even death of animals, all due to inadequate care and questionable practices.
3. Marineland has faced multiple lawsuits, including 11 counts of animal cruelty, which were eventually dropped, and a $21 million lawsuit against the OSPCA for malicious prosecution.
4. Marineland has a long history of suing anyone who speaks out against their practices, creating a climate of fear and silencing critics.

Phil Demers’ Legal Battle with Marineland

1. Marineland sued Phil Demers for plotting to steal Smootie the walrus, a claim he vehemently denies, and gained access to his personal phone records.
2. Phil’s legal battle has spanned 5 years, with Marineland attempting to silence him and discourage others from speaking out against them.
3. Phil is seeking to have the lawsuit thrown out and is determined to expose the truth about Marineland’s practices, despite the personal cost.
4. Phil believes that Marineland is using legal tactics to punish him and protect their interests, regardless of the validity of the claims.

The Use of Valium on Marine Mammals

1. Phil reveals that Marineland, and other marine parks like SeaWorld, use Valium (benzodiazepines) on their marine mammals, particularly killer whales.
2. This practice is often used as an appetite stimulant, a desperate measure to manage animals who refuse to eat due to stress or poor conditions.
3. Phil argues that the use of Valium creates a false and misleading image of these intelligent animals, as they appear subdued and compliant, masking their true emotional state.
4. He highlights the disturbing reality that the public may be witnessing drugged and confused animals during performances, rather than the natural behaviors of these complex creatures.

The Ethics of Keeping Marine Mammals in Captivity

1. Phil argues that keeping marine mammals in captivity is inherently wrong, emphasizing the cramped and unnatural environment these highly intelligent animals endure.
2. He highlights the emotional distress and social disruption experienced by these animals, especially killer whales, who live in tightly-knit pods for life.
3. Phil points to the increasing public awareness of the negative consequences of keeping these creatures in confined spaces, as evidenced by declining attendance at marine parks.
4. He believes that the ethical treatment of these animals necessitates a shift away from captivity and towards sanctuaries or the return to their natural environment.

The Future of Marine Mammal Captivity

1. Phil remains hopeful about the future of marine mammal captivity, highlighting the growing momentum for change, evidenced by legislation like Bill S-203 in Canada.
2. He advocates for the establishment of whale sanctuaries, providing a more natural environment for captive whales and dolphins.
3. Phil acknowledges the challenges of releasing captive whales into the wild due to their adaptation to human care and the lack of natural foraging skills.
4. He believes that sanctuaries can serve as a bridge between captivity and release, allowing these animals to experience a more natural life while still receiving care and rehabilitation.

Marineland’s Future and the Importance of Advocacy

1. Phil predicts that Marineland will likely close its doors soon, due to declining attendance, legal battles, and the changing public sentiment toward marine mammal captivity.
2. He acknowledges that the owner is a defiant and powerful figure, potentially willing to tank the park in an act of revenge against his critics.
3. He encourages people to learn more about the issue by watching documentaries like “Blackfish” and supporting organizations advocating for animal welfare.
4. Phil emphasizes the importance of continuing to raise awareness about the ethical treatment of animals, and challenging the practices of institutions that exploit them.

Memorable Quotes:

1. “It’s legit. I don’t sit on wallets. I don’t I don’t play with wallets. Fuck no. You’re ready? You’re right. I wasn’t sure you got up to move cameras around. Phil showed me his you have a it’s a mini fanny pack. It’s very small. It’s it’s like you can carry track everything I need in a small phone. You can’t carry a modern phone. That’s like pre modern Oh, so the 6 fits in there. The sixth plus would this be a problem, maybe. Bang against your deck. I gotta tighten it up.”
2. “So, dude, you’d put, like, the touch on her? They put the touch on her. Yeah. With these 2 hands right here, right in front of her face. And would it is that a normal thing with animals? Like I said, it it almost never happens. Did you hear if animals imprinting on humans a lot of times, not usually at at her age, that was a bit advanced for that to happen? Usually, it happens when they’re young. Right? If it’s gonna happen. Yeah. But it does it does happen when people raise bears and a lot of weird animals that you wouldn’t ordinarily think as pets And I don’t know if it would be an actual imprint. Like, the imprint is different. There’s 1 thing of familiarizing. How do you differentiate? Well, it’s just it’s natural.”
3. “They got them all. Yeah. They know how to book you their case. Everything. Yeah. Wow. It’s crazy. And I have 0 from them after 5 years. Because they’re using the system as a means to just simply abuse me and acting the fool as their as Greenland’s legal team does exceptionally well, proves proves very effective in, you know, abusing a guy like me, whereas a corporation with endless amounts of money, just suit the shit out of me.”
4. “I mean, we used to we used to drop we used to call this Beluga rodeo. And at Marineland, Marineland’s notorious for having, like, I we have I say we over fifth, that puts their push in 60 Baluigas at this point. And this is why it’s so important to start changing these fucking laws because this is absurd. And and it creates a whole world of problems of course, socially for these animals, babies get killed by males. It’s it’s yeah. It’s gross. It’s bad. It’s not manageable. Nonetheless, what we would do is We dropped the water in 1 of the pools so you have anywhere between 10 and 15 balloons flat on their stomach. There’s a great at the bottom of it. They can’t move. They can’t move. Well, If they wanna move, they can, but they’re flopping around. But it means they’re gonna get fucked up bad. Like, scratched up by the the ground So if you’ve got maybe a a little bit of water, we we’ve tried different things to try to mitigate how damaged up they got. There was 1 time mean, they get carved up. We used to call it I mean, it’s morbid, but we used to joke around, we used to call it the Caesar Water because it was blood red by the time we were done. These procedures I’m telling you, Joe, it would make you sick. It was the water was thick of blood.”
5. “I want the waters. Sounds crazy. My dream is I’m gonna free whales. There’s gonna be a sanctuary. I’m gonna free marine lands whales. I’m gonna have a hand in this. That’s gonna happen. Number 2, do you really think that’s gonna happen? You think they’re gonna enact legislation that makes them release those? Animals? I think so. Yes. Really? Yes. What makes you so hopeful? Well, s 02:03, they Marineland’s tried to kill this bill for years now, they’ve not been able to. And this time next week, the sucker should go. That whale sanctuary sanctuary project. They’re gonna build a whale sanctuary. There’s gonna be a place for whales.”