JRE #371 – Rick Doblin

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7/1/2013






Joe Rogan Podcast #371 – Rick Doblin: Topics and Summary

This episode of the Joe Rogan Experience delves into the world of psychedelics with Rick Doblin, founder and executive director of MAPS (Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies). From the cultural impact of psychedelics and the history of their use to the potential benefits of MDMA therapy and the ongoing fight for marijuana legalization, Doblin shares his expertise and insights on a complex and often misunderstood subject.

Major Topics

  1. Psychedelics and Culture:
    • Doblin emphasizes the importance of using the term “psychedelic” instead of euphemisms, reclaiming the word and acknowledging the true nature of these substances.
    • He argues that the cultural context of the 1960s was not yet ready for the integration of psychedelics, leading to a backlash and misperceptions.
    • Doblin believes that with the evolution of our culture and increased acceptance of holistic practices like yoga and meditation, we are now at a point where psychedelics can be responsibly integrated.
    • He highlights the potential of psychedelics not as a rebellion against society, but as a tool for enhancing what we are already doing collectively.
  2. The Power of Integration:
    • Doblin emphasizes the importance of integration work, the process of bringing back insights and experiences from psychedelic journeys and incorporating them into daily life.
    • He argues that integration is key to achieving lasting benefits from psychedelic experiences, preventing potential imbalances and ensuring that the insights gained are anchored in reality.
    • He highlights the role of therapy and ongoing support in the integration process, acknowledging that it is a personal journey that requires commitment and effort.
    • Doblin emphasizes that while psychedelic experiences can be transformative, they are not a magic bullet, and require conscious effort to integrate for lasting change.
  3. Psychedelic Therapy and MDMA:
    • Doblin outlines MAPS’ ongoing research into the therapeutic potential of MDMA, particularly for treating PTSD.
    • He highlights the success of clinical trials using MDMA with veterans, firefighters, and now, even police officers, demonstrating the potential of this therapy for individuals who have experienced trauma.
    • Doblin discusses the challenges of navigating the regulatory landscape and the need to prove both safety and efficacy of MDMA before it can be widely adopted as a prescription medicine.
    • He emphasizes that MDMA therapy is not about erasing memories or suppressing emotions, but about processing trauma and fostering emotional healing.
  4. The Hemp Industry and Legalization:
    • Doblin discusses the irony of the United States being the largest importer of hemp while simultaneously prohibiting its domestic cultivation.
    • He argues that the pharmaceutical industry’s opposition to marijuana legalization stems from the potential for hemp to be a highly effective and versatile resource, threatening their market share.
    • Doblin highlights the countless uses of hemp beyond its psychoactive properties, from protein powder to construction materials, and calls for a paradigm shift in our understanding of this plant.
    • He points out that the legal restrictions on hemp cultivation are a prime example of how social control and fear can blind us to the potential of natural resources.
  5. The Drug War and Social Repression:
    • Doblin argues that the drug war has been a tool for social repression, targeting minorities and those who challenge societal norms.
    • He believes that the fear of losing control over a population’s consciousness has fueled the prohibition of psychedelics and marijuana.
    • Doblin emphasizes the need to move beyond punitive measures and embrace a more compassionate and inclusive approach to drug policy.
    • He advocates for a paradigm shift towards harm reduction, education, and personal responsibility, instead of relying on prohibition and criminalization.
  6. The Importance of Self-Examination:
    • Doblin emphasizes the importance of self-examination and the need to face uncomfortable truths about ourselves and our culture.
    • He acknowledges the fear that arises when we confront our deepest desires and vulnerabilities, and encourages a process of self-acceptance and healing.
    • He believes that psychedelics can facilitate this process of self-discovery and help us to overcome the fear of our own darkness.
    • Doblin suggests that true growth and transformation come from embracing our imperfections and challenging our limiting beliefs.
  7. The Futility of Fear and the Power of Compassion:
    • Doblin highlights the destructive nature of fear and how it can drive irrational behavior and societal repression.
    • He believes that the key to overcoming fear is through compassion, self-acceptance, and a recognition of our shared humanity.
    • Doblin emphasizes the need to move beyond the us-versus-them mentality and foster a sense of unity and understanding.
    • He argues that by embracing compassion, we can create a more just and equitable society, one that recognizes the value of all individuals and their right to explore their own consciousness.
  8. The Evolution of Consciousness:
    • Doblin suggests that just as psychedelics might have played a role in the evolution of human consciousness in the past, they hold the potential for further evolution in the future.
    • He believes that psychedelics, when used responsibly and with the proper support, can help us to transcend our limitations and access deeper levels of understanding and awareness.
    • Doblin emphasizes that this evolution of consciousness is not a linear process, but rather a cyclical journey of discovery and integration.
    • He argues that by embracing the potential of psychedelics and other transformative tools, we can unlock our collective potential and create a more enlightened future.
  9. The Need for Open Dialogue and Education:
    • Doblin emphasizes the importance of open dialogue and education about psychedelics, challenging the stigma and misinformation surrounding these substances.
    • He encourages people to share their experiences, both positive and negative, and to engage in respectful and informed discussions about the potential of these tools.
    • Doblin advocates for a more nuanced and evidence-based approach to drug policy, one that acknowledges the complexities of human consciousness and the potential for both harm and healing.
    • He believes that by fostering open communication and promoting a culture of informed consent, we can create a safer and more compassionate environment for exploring consciousness.
  10. MAPS’ Role in Research and Advocacy:
    • Doblin outlines MAPS’ commitment to conducting rigorous scientific research and advocating for a more progressive drug policy.
    • He highlights the organization’s role in pushing the boundaries of psychedelic research, challenging the status quo and advocating for the rights of individuals to explore their own consciousness.
    • Doblin emphasizes the need for public support and funding to continue MAPS’ work, encouraging listeners to contribute to the organization’s efforts through membership, donations, and advocacy.
    • He expresses hope that through the combined efforts of researchers, advocates, and informed individuals, we can create a future where psychedelics are recognized as valuable tools for healing, growth, and societal evolution.

Memorable Quotes

  • “And I was hoping that we can change the cultural connotations from what it was in the sixties of psychedelics, rebellion dropping out, finding your own sort of private utopia somewhere, a certain kind of not integrated into the culture.”
  • “So I made it multidisciplinary, which means we could look at psychedelics from virtually any perspective, association to mean that it’s publicly supported, a nonprofit. And I had images of, you know, tens of thousands of people banding together to support research in different areas.”
  • “And so I wanted to use the word psychedelic so people knew what I was doing. And I was hoping that we can change the cultural connotations from what it was in the sixties of psychedelics, rebellion dropping out, finding your own sort of private utopia somewhere, a certain kind of not integrated into the culture.”
  • “I think we all have those kind of parts where they’re not really integrated and it seems extreme and you let the emotions carry you. Yes. So that the safe plays, we have to be careful, I think, is true, but the bad trip the difficult challenge, the death rebirth that’s in all of us.”
  • “And I think that’s where we’ve lost touch with that. And there’s so much coming from people finding it on their own through various methods that the culture is changing?”


 

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