JRE #417 - Graham Hancock

11/13/2013

Joe Rogan Experience Podcast #417 – Graham Hancock

This podcast delves into the world of Graham Hancock, a renowned author and journalist, exploring his theories on ancient civilizations, cataclysmic events, and the profound impact of psychedelic experiences. Provocative topics include alternative history, the possibility of a lost civilization, the role of psychedelics in human evolution, and the dangers of societal amnesia. Underlying themes explore the limitations of mainstream history, the potential for radical transformation, and the importance of questioning established paradigms.

Major Topics Explored in Podcast #417:

1. Graham Hancock’s Extensive Travels:

Hancock recounts his whirlwind tour across nations, visiting Turkey, Peru, Bolivia, South Africa, and the United States. His travels serve as a testament to his relentless pursuit of knowledge and exploration.
He highlights his encounter with Klaus Schmidt, a German archaeologist excavating Göbekli Tepe, a significant megalithic site.
Hancock shares his observations about underground cities in Turkey, questioning their conventional purpose.
He describes his journeys to the high Andes, visiting Chavín de Huántar and Tiwanaku, sites where ancient cultures venerated psychedelics.

2. Graham Hancock’s Vegetarianism and the Morality of Food:

Hancock explains his vegetarian diet, which avoids meat and fish, but includes shellfish. He doesn’t subscribe to a strictly moral justification for his choices but acknowledges the ethical implications of consuming animal products.
The conversation delves into the complexities of food consumption, questioning the ethicality of consuming any form of life, including plants. The podcast encourages a nuanced view of the interconnectedness of life.
Joe Rogan, who has recently taken up hunting, shares his perspective on the importance of a direct connection with the food chain, advocating for ethical hunting practices over industrial slaughterhouses.
The discussion on vegetarianism and hunting explores the tension between individual choices and the broader context of the web of life, questioning the extent to which our modern lifestyle has divorced us from the natural world.

3. The Kenyan Tribe’s Rituals and Human Potential:

Hancock recounts a Radio Lab episode discussing a tribe in Kenya that produces an extraordinary number of successful runners. The episode explores the factors contributing to their athletic prowess, including body shape, running to and from school, and a brutal tribal ritual.
The ritual involves intense pain tolerance, including circumcision with a sharp stick, crawling through stinging nettles, and running at full pace, demonstrating the tribe’s commitment to developing physical and mental strength.
The podcast highlights the contrast between this tribe’s embrace of pain and our modern society’s avoidance of discomfort, questioning the potential consequences of our sanitized lifestyle.
The discussion on the Kenyan tribe serves as a springboard for exploring themes of resilience, endurance, and the importance of pushing our limits to achieve peak human potential.

4. Subsistence Living and the Search for Happiness:

Hancock and Rogan discuss shows that depict subsistence living, particularly “Life Below Zero”, showcasing the challenges and rewards of a traditional, hunter-gatherer lifestyle in Alaska. The podcast explores the disconnect between our modern existence and our ancestral way of life.
They discuss the irony of modern technology failing to deliver on the promise of increased happiness, leading to a yearning for simpler, more fulfilling lives.
Hancock suggests that our genetics may not have caught up to the rapid changes in our lifestyle, contributing to feelings of dissatisfaction and an underlying longing for connection with nature.
The conversation highlights the importance of striking a balance between technological advancements and the fulfillment of our primal needs, questioning whether our pursuit of progress has sacrificed our well-being.

5. The Internet and Global Connectivity:

Hancock and Rogan discuss the transformative power of the internet and its impact on communication, information sharing, and the formation of global communities. The podcast explores the potential for the internet to foster understanding and connection across cultures and ideologies.
The discussion touches upon the internet’s role in challenging the status quo, empowering individuals to access information and voice their opinions without relying on traditional media outlets.
Hancock emphasizes the internet’s ability to expose and undermine the control exerted by powerful institutions, particularly regarding the suppression of controversial ideas and information.
The conversation highlights the internet’s potential to revolutionize communication and knowledge dissemination, paving the way for a more open and informed world.

6. The War on Drugs and the Suppression of Psychedelics:

Hancock and Rogan critique the war on drugs, emphasizing the misguided nature of criminalizing psychedelic substances. They advocate for a more nuanced and open dialogue about the potential benefits of psychedelics.
The conversation highlights the detrimental impact of the war on drugs on individuals and society, highlighting the limitations of a purely punitive approach to drug use.
They discuss the use of ibogaine, a powerful psychedelic, in treating opioid addiction, acknowledging the potential for psychedelics to address mental health challenges and promote healing.
The podcast calls for a re-evaluation of our relationship with psychedelic substances, advocating for responsible use and open research to explore their potential benefits.

7. The Mystery of Consciousness and the Role of Psychedelics:

Hancock and Rogan explore the nature of consciousness and its relationship to the physical world, questioning whether the mind is merely a product of the brain or a more complex phenomenon.
They discuss the potential for consciousness to be non-local, drawing parallels with the workings of antennas and the concept of a “divine spark” within human beings.
Hancock argues that psychedelic experiences offer a unique perspective on the nature of reality, suggesting that they can challenge our preconceived notions about the world and expand our understanding of ourselves.
The conversation delves into the philosophical implications of psychedelic experiences, exploring the potential for transcendence, spiritual awakening, and the integration of a broader understanding of consciousness into our worldview.

8. The Flotation Tank and Sensory Deprivation:

Hancock passionately advocates for the benefits of flotation tanks, describing them as a safe and natural way to achieve altered states of consciousness.
He details the experience of floating in a tank filled with Epsom salt water, highlighting the sensory deprivation, weightlessness, and relaxation it promotes.
Hancock describes the profound introspection and self-discovery that can occur in the absence of external stimuli, leading to insights into one’s life and a deep sense of tranquility.
The discussion on flotation tanks underscores the importance of creating spaces for introspection and self-exploration, suggesting that sensory deprivation can be a valuable tool for personal growth and transformation.

9. The Discovery of a 1.8 Million-Year-Old Human Skull:

Hancock discusses the discovery of a 1.8 million-year-old human skull found in Georgia, a significant find that challenges our understanding of human evolution. The podcast explores the implications of this discovery for our understanding of early hominids and the complexity of human history.
The skull, referred to as “Skull 5”, represents a remarkable find, being a completely preserved adult hominid from the early Pleistocene epoch. The discovery throws into question established timelines and raises new questions about the diversity of early human species.
The podcast explores the potential for multiple lines of human evolution, citing examples like the “Hobbit” (Homo floresiensis) and a 40,000-year-old Russian hominid, emphasizing the vast unknowns surrounding our evolutionary history.
The conversation underscores the importance of embracing a more fluid and open-minded approach to understanding human origins, acknowledging the ongoing discoveries that challenge our preconceived notions.

10. Cryptozoology and the Orang Pendek:

Hancock discusses the Orang Pendek, a cryptid from Malaysia that resembles a small, ape-like creature. The podcast explores the possibility that the Orang Pendek could be a surviving descendant of Homo floresiensis or a yet-unidentified hominid species.
The conversation touches upon the significance of the discovery of Homo floresiensis, a small hominid species that lived until relatively recent times, highlighting the potential for undiscovered hominid species to exist.
Hancock’s interest in the Orang Pendek and other cryptids reflects a broader fascination with the unknown, acknowledging the potential for hidden mysteries within the natural world.
The discussion on cryptozoology serves as a reminder of the vast unknowns surrounding the natural world and the importance of maintaining an open mind when exploring the possibilities.

11. The Megalithic Site of Gunung Padang and its Implications:

Hancock discusses the megalithic site of Gunung Padang in Indonesia, recently redated to potentially 20,000 years old. This groundbreaking discovery would rewrite our understanding of ancient civilizations and their capabilities.
The site, composed of gigantic basalt columns, has been known for centuries, but recent investigations have revealed deeper layers, revealing megaliths dating back to the Late Pleistocene epoch. The findings suggest the existence of advanced architectural skills and complex societies far earlier than previously thought.
Hancock emphasizes the significance of Gunung Padang in conjunction with Göbekli Tepe, both man-made hills containing megaliths, suggesting the potential for a global network of ancient, advanced civilizations.
The podcast highlights the potential for radical reinterpretations of history, questioning the dominant narrative and suggesting the possibility of a more interconnected and sophisticated past.

12. The Younger Dryas Impact Event and its Consequences:

Hancock discusses the Younger Dryas impact event, a cataclysmic event that occurred around 12,900 years ago, marking the transition from the Late Glacial Period to the Holocene epoch. The event is believed to have been caused by a comet impact, resulting in widespread environmental devastation and potentially the collapse of a global civilization.
He highlights evidence supporting the impact event, including the presence of platinum in Greenland ice cores, a layer of melted glass across the globe, and the abrupt climate change associated with the Younger Dryas event.
Hancock argues that the Younger Dryas event could explain the disappearance of advanced civilizations and the subsequent rise of new cultures, suggesting a cyclical pattern of destruction and renewal in human history.
The conversation emphasizes the importance of acknowledging cataclysmic events in our understanding of history, challenging the traditional view of smooth and gradual progress and highlighting the potential for abrupt and transformative events to shape our past.

13. The Role of Oral Traditions and Societal Amnesia:

Hancock emphasizes the importance of oral traditions in preserving knowledge and understanding the past. He laments the destruction of oral traditions by modern society, which favors written records and digital information.
He warns of the dangers of societal amnesia, pointing to the fragility of our reliance on digital storage and the potential for losing vast amounts of knowledge in the event of a catastrophe.
The podcast discusses the implications of our cultural amnesia for understanding the past and shaping the future, highlighting the importance of preserving and valuing oral traditions as a critical source of knowledge.
The conversation underscores the need for a more balanced approach to knowledge preservation, acknowledging the value of oral traditions alongside written and digital records.

14. The Egyptian Sphinx and its Ancient Origins:

Hancock delves into the mystery surrounding the Egyptian Sphinx, highlighting the work of Robert Schoch and John Anthony West, who have argued that the Sphinx is significantly older than conventional dating suggests, potentially dating back to the Late Pleistocene epoch.
He emphasizes the evidence for water erosion on the Sphinx, indicating that it was exposed to prolonged rainfall, a condition not present in the Egyptian climate for thousands of years. This evidence points to a much earlier date for the Sphinx’s construction.
Hancock argues that the Sphinx’s age and architectural sophistication challenge the established chronology of Egyptian history, suggesting the potential for a more advanced civilization existing in the Late Pleistocene epoch.
The conversation explores the significance of the Sphinx as a potential link to a lost civilization, suggesting that its age and architectural prowess could be evidence of a more ancient and sophisticated human history.

15. The Role of Psychedelics in Ancient Cultures:

Hancock emphasizes the role of psychedelics in shaping ancient cultures, citing evidence from various sites, including Chavín de Huántar, Tiwanaku, and Caral in South America, as well as the Aztec civilization in Mexico.
He highlights the use of psychedelics in rituals, art, and mythology, suggesting that they played a significant role in shaping human consciousness and worldview.
Hancock argues that the dismissal of psychedelics by mainstream academia has led to a distorted understanding of ancient cultures, preventing us from fully appreciating the profound impact of these substances.
The podcast advocates for a more open and nuanced approach to studying psychedelics, acknowledging their potential for spiritual growth, creative inspiration, and a deeper understanding of the human experience.

16. The Aztec Civilization and Human Sacrifice:

Hancock discusses the Aztec civilization and their practice of human sacrifice, exploring the reasons behind this horrific ritual. The podcast highlights the influence of psychedelic experiences on the Aztec worldview, suggesting that their beliefs about supernatural entities and the need for human sacrifice were informed by their use of psilocybin mushrooms.
He emphasizes the brutality and scale of Aztec human sacrifice, describing the systematic and ritualistic nature of the practice, which involved the sacrifice of tens of thousands of people. The podcast underscores the importance of understanding the darker aspects of human history.
Hancock explores the potential role of demonic forces in shaping Aztec beliefs and practices, suggesting that the Aztec god of war, Huitzilopochtli, could be a manifestation of a dark spiritual entity that thrived on human sacrifice.
The discussion on the Aztec civilization serves as a cautionary tale, highlighting the dangers of unchecked power, the influence of distorted beliefs, and the need for a more compassionate and enlightened worldview.

17. The Spanish Conquest of Mexico and the Role of Malinalli:

Hancock discusses the Spanish conquest of Mexico, focusing on the role of Malinalli, a real historical figure who served as a translator and mistress to Hernán Cortés. The podcast highlights the importance of understanding the complexities of this historical event and the impact of individual choices on the course of history.
He emphasizes Malinalli’s role as a key player in Cortés’s conquest, highlighting her ability to navigate cultural differences, translate languages, and exploit Aztec beliefs to Cortés’s advantage. The conversation explores the power of language and cultural understanding in shaping the course of history.
Hancock emphasizes the complexity of Malinalli’s role, acknowledging her motivations for siding with Cortés and the consequences of her actions. The podcast highlights the moral ambiguity inherent in historical events and the importance of considering multiple perspectives.
The discussion on the Spanish conquest of Mexico serves as a reminder of the ongoing influence of historical events on our present and the importance of studying the past to learn from its complexities and avoid repeating its mistakes.

18. The Importance of Challenging the Paradigm:

Hancock criticizes the tendency for mainstream academia, particularly in archaeology, to resist challenging established paradigms. He argues that this reluctance to consider alternative perspectives has led to a distorted understanding of history.
He cites the example of Göbekli Tepe and the reaction of Klaus Schmidt, the archaeologist leading the excavation, who despite acknowledging the site’s significance, still seeks to fit it into an existing framework rather than truly embracing its revolutionary implications.
Hancock emphasizes the importance of critical thinking and open-mindedness in scientific research, advocating for a more flexible and inquisitive approach to understanding the past.
The podcast underscores the need for a constant reevaluation of our assumptions and the importance of challenging the established narratives to uncover new truths and expand our understanding of the world.

19. The Future of Humanity:

Hancock expresses cautious optimism about the future of humanity, acknowledging the challenges facing our society while recognizing the potential for positive change.
He highlights the growing awareness of our interconnectedness, the potential of technology to empower individuals, and the rising spirit of global unity as signs of hope.
Hancock emphasizes the importance of individual choices in shaping a more sustainable and compassionate future, advocating for a shift from fear-based thinking to love-based action.
The podcast concludes with a call for collective action, urging listeners to embrace their individual power to create a more just and equitable world, one that values truth, compassion, and a deeper understanding of our interconnectedness.

Memorable Quotes from the Podcast:

“Our society at its actually crazy. It’s crazy. It’s run by crazy people in pursuit of crazy motives, and it is designed to diminish human potential.” – Hancock critiques the societal structures and forces that he believes are working against the realization of human potential.
“I think that maybe in our society and western technological society, you know, we’ve got so divorced from the act of actually killing an animal that we forget what we’re doing.” – Hancock expresses concern about the disconnect between our modern food consumption and the reality of animal slaughter.
“This is a deep personal journey, which requires strength of character to fulfill. Without a doubt, I’ve done some terrifying things in my life, but the moment before you you you light the lighter that that fires up the DMT is one of the most terrifying moments of all time.” – Hancock describes the intense and challenging nature of psychedelic experiences.
“We’re starting to see in our lifetime these centers in Mexico. My friend Ed Clay runs one in Mexico, and I know there’s some in Canada as well where they have these ibogaine centers where people are going and completely curing themselves from opiates. ” – Hancock highlights the potential of psychedelics in treating addiction and promoting healing.
“The love is the opposite of fear. Fear is what is what presses our buttons today. It’s what’s used deliberately to press our buttons. And and what’s the opposite of that is is love. That’s what we need.” – Hancock emphasizes the importance of love and compassion in overcoming fear and creating a more just and equitable world.

JRE #417 – Graham Hancock