3/13/2017
This podcast delves deep into Will MacAskill’s philosophy and the effective altruism movement, exploring themes of giving, suffering, and the future of humanity. It touches on controversial topics like artificial intelligence, the experience machine, and the ethics of meat consumption. The conversation also explores the potential for a future beyond homo sapiens and the complexities of our current state as a species.
1. Effective Altruism:
MacAskill defines effective altruism as the pursuit of doing the most good with our resources.
He advocates for prioritizing charities that demonstrably achieve the greatest impact.
His commitment to effective altruism is evident in his personal decision to donate most of his income to charitable causes.
He highlights the need for thoughtful evaluation of charities, emphasizing that not all are equally effective.
2. The Hedonic Treadmill and Materialism:
MacAskill contends that money doesn’t equate to happiness, citing the hedonic treadmill, where increased wealth leads to increased needs.
He suggests that once basic needs are met, additional money has a minimal impact on well-being.
He observes the insatiable desire for material possessions in affluent communities, attributing it to the belief that these things are necessary for happiness.
He argues that a fulfilling life stems from relationships, purpose, and making a difference, rather than material wealth.
3. The Future of Humanity and Artificial Intelligence:
MacAskill expresses concern about the potential risks and benefits of artificial intelligence, particularly the possibility of creating superhuman AI.
He raises the question of whether we are on the verge of a new evolutionary stage, where artificial intelligence surpasses human intelligence and perhaps even renders us obsolete.
He advocates for proactive engagement with AI development to ensure a positive transition, highlighting the need to carefully consider its potential implications.
He frames the future of humanity as a potential transition to a post-human era, where intelligent life may be in a different form than homo sapiens.
4. The Experience Machine and the Nature of Reality:
MacAskill explores the experience machine thought experiment, posing the question of whether we would choose a simulated life of perfect happiness over our current reality.
He acknowledges the possibility of creating indistinguishable simulated realities in the future, raising questions about our ability to distinguish between reality and simulation.
He discusses Nick Bostrom’s simulation argument, which suggests that it is statistically more likely that we are living in a simulation than in the “base” reality.
He critiques the simulation argument, suggesting that the concept of an infinite universe invalidates the premise that simulations would outweigh the “real” universe.
5. Consciousness and the Hard Problem:
MacAskill examines the nature of consciousness, arguing that conscious experience is the ultimate value, with positive experiences being good and negative experiences being bad.
He contends that consciousness is likely a physical process, citing the principle of conservation of energy.
He acknowledges the existence of the “hard problem” of consciousness, the difficulty in explaining the relationship between subjective experience and physical processes.
He suggests that we are currently at a point of limited scientific understanding regarding consciousness, highlighting the need for further exploration.
6. The Ethics of Meat Consumption:
MacAskill raises the ethical implications of meat consumption, arguing that factory farming represents a significant source of animal suffering.
He suggests that focusing on eliminating factory farming is more impactful than other forms of animal activism, such as banning pets.
He presents a case for evaluating meat consumption based on the suffering inflicted on individual animals and the number of animals affected.
He advocates for plant-based diets as a more ethical and sustainable option, citing the environmental impact and resource efficiency of animal agriculture.
7. The Fermi Paradox and the Search for Extraterrestrial Life:
MacAskill discusses the Fermi Paradox, which poses the question of why we haven’t observed evidence of alien civilizations despite the vastness of the universe.
He proposes that the scarcity of alien life might be attributed to the extreme unlikelihood of life emerging in the first place or the challenges of transitioning from single-celled organisms to multicellular life.
He explores the possibility that advanced civilizations might turn inward rather than expanding into space, suggesting that internal focus might be a more likely outcome than interstellar travel.
He also considers the possibility that humanity might be the most advanced life form in the observable universe, questioning the assumption that something more advanced must exist.
8. The Role of Hunting and Conservation:
MacAskill examines the role of hunting in conservation efforts, highlighting the unexpected fact that a significant portion of funding for wildlife preservation comes from hunting licenses.
He acknowledges the contradiction between hunting and conservation, but suggests that hunters are often more dedicated to preserving wildlife populations than organizations solely focused on conservation.
He notes the surprising success of hunting in boosting certain wildlife populations, highlighting the complex and sometimes counterintuitive relationship between humans and the natural world.
9. The Future of Meat and the Rise of Laboratory-Grown Meat:
MacAskill expresses cautious optimism regarding laboratory-grown meat, citing its potential to eliminate animal suffering while providing a more sustainable and potentially healthier alternative to traditional meat.
He acknowledges concerns about the safety and potential long-term effects of laboratory-grown meat, but argues that these concerns are likely surmountable with further research.
He foresees a future where laboratory-grown meat becomes the dominant form of meat consumption, leading to a shift in societal attitudes toward animal agriculture.
He highlights the potential for laboratory-grown meat to become more efficient and sustainable than traditional meat production.
10. The Banality of Evil and the Consequences of Civilization:
MacAskill delves into the banality of evil, suggesting that harmful actions can be the result of indifference to suffering rather than malicious intent.
He uses factory farming as an example of how a seemingly harmless act (consuming meat) can have devastating consequences for animals.
He emphasizes the importance of considering the impact of our choices, even those that seem innocuous, and the need to hold individuals accountable for the suffering they cause.
He suggests that the consequences of our civilization, such as factory farming, are often driven by a focus on economic gain at the expense of ethical considerations.
11. The Nature of Democracy and the Limitations of Voting:
MacAskill explores the nature of democracy and the limitations of voting, suggesting that the current system is inadequate for capturing the will of the people.
He advocates for alternative voting systems, such as ranked-choice voting, that offer a more nuanced and accurate representation of voters’ preferences.
He raises concerns about the influence of third-party candidates and the potential for voting systems to be manipulated or misrepresent the electorate.
He suggests that more informed and deliberative approaches to decision-making are needed to ensure that democracy effectively serves the people.
12. The Politics of Brexit and the Future of the European Union:
MacAskill discusses the politics of Brexit and the potential for Scotland to become independent from the UK.
He suggests that the economic case for Scotland remaining within the EU might be stronger now that the UK is leaving.
He expresses concern about the potential for Brexit to destabilize the European Union and trigger further fragmentation, leading to potential conflict.
He acknowledges the complexities of the sovereignty issue and the arguments for and against the European Union, highlighting the need for careful consideration of all perspectives.
5 Memorable Quotes:
“The things that make me happier, like being surrounded by friends, that’s free. Gym membership, that’s like 40 dollars a month or something. It’s not very much. I can afford that.” – MacAskill highlights the importance of relationships and simple pleasures over material wealth.
“I think if I had a yacht, that would make my life worse. Because I would be stressing about this yacht, like, once it gets damaged, like, I feel bad that I’m not using it.” – MacAskill illustrates the potential downsides of material possessions.
“I think the number of charities that you think are just, yeah, this is literally competing for being the most effective charity in the world, that’s actually very small.” – MacAskill emphasizes the importance of identifying the most effective charities, not just any charity.
“If intelligent features are still around, in a thousand years’ time, it’s gonna be something that’s not homo sapiens.” – MacAskill contemplates the possibility of a future beyond homo sapiens.
“I think the only thing that’s valuable ultimately is conscious experience.” – MacAskill defines the ultimate value as conscious experience, highlighting the importance of reducing suffering and promoting happiness.